Phil. You most certainly brought on a ten rounder there. Why not look at your technique book and see the difference in the rise and fall as written for the first three of a Natural Turn in the Waltz. Then look at the rise and fall in the Feather Step as in the Foxtrot, both the International style of dancing There are four different rise and fall. Above is two of them.

Hi Don
I don't just look it up in the technique book for the simple reason that i can't have a discussion with the technique book. And there is room for discussion. It's the same at colleges and universities - students aren't just asked to read a text book, there are lectures and tutorials.
Anyway, it's more fun here, though the discussion often strays off the original point, as is the case here.
On another point (and to stray even further), why is it that the technique books have virtually no pictures when dancing is clearly such a visual art form? Good visuals would explain the difference between waltz and foxtrot rise far better than words. A picture is worth a thousand words, and all that

The technique books were not written for dance students, but for dance teachers. If you aren't interested in learning how to use professional reference material, it's perfectly fine to ask your teacher.

A technique book is like a cook book. Two people can use the same recipe and come up with different result. Thats why we need GOOD teachers who know what's missing in the book and have knowledge that is far superior to any book.

"Thats why we need GOOD teachers who know what's missing in the book and have knowledge that is far superior to any book."

Actually there's a lot in the book that's missing in most teachers' dancing. But it's subtle - if these were widely discussed concepts, they wouldn't be missing in so much otherwise skilled actual dancing. One of the major difference between top ordinary teachers and world-experts is attention to little details that are implicit in the the book descriptions, but often ignored.

If it's all in the book,why do some experts disagee that we pull our weight onto the heal of the foot?

"If it's all in the book,why do some experts disagee that we pull our weight onto the heal of the foot?"

Because unlike those who mistakenly argue for that, they know it's inefficient and only usefull in a body position which causes other problems. The fact that the book doesn't tell you to pull onto a heel is not important.

So you don't agree with Geoffrey Hearn the author of the Choreographer and a trainer of world champions. There were people who did not agree that the world was flat and perhaps still do.

If you want to compare to flat earther's, I'll point out the physics can easily demonstrate the flaws in both propositions: flat earth, and utility of pulling onto a foot that is in advance of your body.

Guys - break it up!!
I use text books a lot (i'm a professional educator but in a different area). And text books are far from perfect. A lot of them have very poor methods and ideas in them - they're written by people just like you and I - and the dance technique books are really no different.
Very good teacher with the technique (or reference) book as a back-up, and keeping up with best practice. That's the only way really