Anonymous. How can I turn my body without turning my shoulders. Are you sure that's what you meant. Are you deliberately trying to incorrectly aligne your spine. If you are you are in for back problems eventually. Are you aware that the knees are veered into each other and that you are going to use an inside edge on the second step. If you continue walking you will turn a complete circle. But more importantly the placing of the second step is preditermined by the first step which is in CBMP as would the third step which would predetermine the fourth step if we kept walking.

"Anonymous. How can I turn my body without turning my shoulders."

With practice. Remember that in dance language, your body is your hips.

"Are you sure that's what you meant."

Yes

"Are you deliberately trying to incorrectly aligne your spine."

No, I am rotating around it, I am not bending it backwards like so many do. The human body is designed to do what I do. Since it is a rotational movement, the body weight remains aligned with the spine - this avoids the risk of injury involved in bending the spine to misposition the weight. You are free to turn around your spine without injury, but you need to be very carefull of bending it in the arched back way.

"Are you aware that the knees are veered into each other and that you are going to use an inside edge on the second step. If you continue walking you will turn a complete circle. But more importantly the placing of the second step is preditermined by the first step which is in CBMP as would the third step which would predetermine the fourth step if we kept walking."

What's your point?

My argument is with your distorted topline cause by allowing your shoulders to rotate into your partners' space, not with your foot placement.

Perform the step properly and your right side will arrive first, but your partnership will still be built around a left side stretch in the topline - your right side leads the movement, but your left side leads in the hold. You musn't loose the left side stretch and orientation of the hold unless you plan to switch your partnership offset to the other side.

Don,

I don't particularly relish telling you this, but the lack of structural coherence in your posts destroys your good intentions. Also, your constant references to luminari (John Woods, Anne Lewis, etc...) conveys only the impression of self-aggrandizement. Not to mention the prominent lack of the ability to analyse a movement based on its merits alone and not the words or doctrine of another.

I also think someone has to tell you that the information you're sharing is sometimes patently misguided, misunderstood, or incoherent, as your recent post above demonstrates.

I am not saying that all your advice is flawed, but I urge you to take more care in what you write. Please realize that there are beginners out there who might take to heart some misguided piece of information, and take a lifetime to correct.

I realize this is a breach in forum etiquette and for that I truly apologize.


With sincerest regards,

JB

Anonymous. I found your post on the use of CBM very interesting. Although the technique books have dropped the left and right shoulder leading in preference to left and right side leading which of course indicates that the hip and shoulder turn as one. But I always remember the late Charles Thiebault saying that he found the majority of dancers try to turn the hips and shoulders in one piece, which in his view, was entirely wrong. He also stated he did not know of any other art or sport, where participants attempt to do this.

lluv2Dance. Charles Thiebault. That's going back a long way, close to 50 years. The straight spine. I have been istructed that if the spine is twisted the lady gets a wrong message. In fact I was made to do the ladies steps to prove that point. I found myself being put in the wrong position for a comfotable Heel Turn. Putting that aside I just don't see any of the top dancers not coming around in what I would call a solid unit. It is easy to pick in a Reverse Turn second step.
Did you go to Blackpool this year.
Best wishes.

Hi Don,
I do tend to go back a bit. This year is my 70 years in dance. Just managed to see the pro final on the Friday in the Gardens. Couldn't see much. I had a rover ticket £21 (US $39), no seat, so stood behind at the back. Spectator dancers today seem to be all 6 footers. I only mentioned Charles because many of the coaches of today were trained mainly by his former pupils.

lluv2Dance . Wasn't Charles Theibault dancing with Sally Brock when he stopped dancing in about 1953.
Blackpool. People who have never been there don't realize that it is impossible to get a seat. I've always managed to get a veiw opposite the left hand side of the stage, right at the end of the first balcony. Even those with seats are standing for the finals. Best Wishes.

I can't remember Charles dancing with Sally. I only know he won the first Blackpool pro after World War 2, dancing with Doreen Beahan. I believe that was in 1946. Fryer was second and Scrivener was third. I do know that Binick (Sally Brock's partner) said after winning at Blackpool he only had one lesson in the past year and that was with Charles.

lluv2Dance.I was going to Guy Haywood's studio in Harrow when Joyce Haywood his daughter retired to get married, that was 1953 after winning the British at Blackpool with Sony Binick. I think that was when Sally Brock split with Charles and danced with Sonny Binick, they later married.

That's right Don. Sonny and Joyce won W, S/FT, and Q/S. Alf Davis & Julie Reaby took the Tango.