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Re: lock technique - slightly rightwards
Posted by Iluv2Dance
5/6/2009  2:43:00 AM
My answer:
4. RF back, backing DC, Lower e/o 4. T.H. Slow.
Re: lock technique - slightly rightwards
Posted by interested
5/6/2009  4:56:00 AM
Why not back and rightwards on 4 ?
Re: lock technique - slightly rightwards
Posted by Iluv2Dance
5/6/2009  5:44:00 AM
Seeking the advice of my mentor, Ken Akrill, he says that if you e-mail him at kenakrill@yahoo.com he will write you the answer. He stipulates that he will only answer to a true name and not the name of 'Interested' in the e-mail address.

He would also like you to write which qualification you are taking and in which society.

I sincerely hope this helps you.
Regards ILuv2dance.
Re: lock technique - slightly rightwards
Posted by interested
5/6/2009  5:55:00 AM
Thanks. I will do that. I'll post back afterwards.
Re: lock technique - slightly rightwards
Posted by SocialDancer
5/6/2009  7:22:00 AM
Would it be "RF back" (as per standard back lock) or "RF back & slightly rightwards" (as per V6) ?


I think you have those the wrong way round, but I may have an answer for you.

The QS forward lock changed slightly between Alex Moore's 3rd and 4th editions. In Ed3 the step is described as 'not yet standardised' and has the LF placed forward. Ed4 introduced the 'forward and slightly to side' idea, and also included a comment that the foot could be placed 'diag forward' for greater progression sideways along the LOD. The ISTD 10th ed. uses 'diag forward' while the IDTA and UKA use 'forward and slightly to side'.

If we invert this to get the back lock, then we have the "RF back & slightly rightwards" or "RF diag back" we are familiar with.

If we accept that this slightly rightwards action is to increase the travel along the LOD then this is appropriate when danced typically backing DW. However, when used as part of the V-6, or the waltz combination you suggest, we are backing DC and moving leftwards along the LOD so we remove the slightly rightwards action.

one more potentially relevant point is that the turning lock to left also has a rightwards on step 3.


In this case the sideways movement is appropriate because we are also starting to turn on this step.
Re: lock technique - slightly rightwards
Posted by interested
5/6/2009  12:45:00 PM
Thank you for your response.

Yes - I did get those things in my previous post the wrong way round - I'll go back and change it.

I had guessed that the reasoning was to do with avoiding the clashing of feet and had not condidered the travel aspect before.

The travel issue raises the question of why would it be more desirable to move along the LOD rather than heading for DW. I would have thought that maximising the movement in the chosen direction of the figure was more important.

Your theory also does not explain the Howard technique for the combination of a half natural back lock & running finish. This has a lock backing LOD but stil has a slightly rightwards component on step 4 of the back lock, which like the V6 would reduce the travel along the LOD.


Another point is that in Hearn's book the Tango Stop Lock Figure has a diagonally back position on the "back" step just before the second lock. Again that is backing DC, with no turn.
Re: lock technique - slightly rightwards
Posted by Three Wise Men
5/7/2009  2:38:00 PM
Interested. There are no instructions on a Back Lock in the International Style which says RF back and slightly rightwards.
Under your own hip line with the right side leading does not constitute a move to the right.
Pay attention to when the partner is outside in CBMP. thats on the first step and hold that line into the crossing of the feet.
Re: lock technique - slightly rightwards
Posted by interested
5/7/2009  7:42:00 PM
There are no instructions on a Back Lock in the International Style which says RF back and slightly rightwards.



It sounds as though you are referring to a very old technique book from the days before the rightwards idea was introduced.
Re: lock technique - slightly rightwards
Posted by Three Wise Men
6/6/2009  3:04:00 PM
Interested. If this is about a Backward Lockstep in the Quickstep, The step does not have anything which would indicate that there is a move right wards. The placing of step two is to get the shoulder and the side our of the way of the person going forward and to allow the locking feet a straight path to the RF with the heel in contact for stability. Done any other way would have the LF trying to find the RF instead of a natural straight path.
Re: lock technique - slightly rightwards
Posted by anymouse
6/6/2009  11:04:00 PM
"If this is about a Backward Lockstep in the Quickstep, The step does not have anything which would indicate that there is a move right wards."

Actually, there is something that indicates this. The first step is given as back in CBMP, meaning that the left foot will fall behind the right foot along the alignment of the right foot. That means that step 2, while given as back, the right foot cannot go absolutely backwards, because the left foot would be there in the way. Instead, it must swing ever so slightly to the right. Continue this direction of movement on the third step, and you get a lock.

This is also consistent with continuing the slightly diagonal (relative to the foot alignment) path of movement of the body - the CBMP position of step one requires this diagonal, and the very slightly rightwards movement of step 2 continues it.

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