The big book -vs- practice difference for natural pivots is that today there is practially no rotation of the foot against the floor.

The foot is placed pre-turned, then is the body passes over and beyond the foot the body aline completes the rotation, with the foot not turning against the floor.

This essentially elimnates the old "held in CBMP" idea. Since the standing foot is not rotating, it is impossible to keep the moving foot on the line of the standing foot (which is the definition of CBMP) - instead the moving leg must swing away from the standing leg, which is more the book action for step 1-2 or 4-5 of a natural than it is anything resembling a book pivot.

And the result is a much clearner, more efficient, and far more dynamic action.

Anonymous.You've lost me at the roundabout. Are you saying that the LF doesn't turn on the floor. One of the main principles in Modern is that the feet always point in the same direction except for some very rare occasions. If you have trouble I would suggest that you turn the toe in very slightly. If this is still the Spin Turn on step four you could do the same. If you can't manage its a safe bet the step is too big.

""4. Do not move you legs and body at the same time. It always has to be legs (feet) and then body follows."

You've got it exactly backwards!!!"

Because of this argument, I looked up World superstars DVD and put the various dancers' mutiple pivot turns on slow motion, just to see if any of them can manage to do mutiple turns by moving body first and then the feet even though we can't. Unfortunately none of them executed it that way. All of them moved their feet first and then their body followed. I don't know how one can do CONTINUOUS PIVOT TURNS by moving the body and then the feet. Try it with your partner. It is simply not possible. Let me add that I am only talking about continous pivot turns, not a single natural turn. Also please post here if there are any dancers on World Super Stars DVD who move their body and then their feet. I am very curious to see it.

If you looked carefully, you would see that their bodies had never stopped moving. Whears their legs start and stop. As a result, the body movement always precedes the leg movement.

Anothe Guest. I also looked up the World Super Stars DVD. I have also looked at many tapes and disks. At this point in time i haven't seen any examples of the body moving ahead of the leg On a Forward Walk or anywhere else.
The only time the body weight goes ahead to the point of imbalance is on a Rumba Walk in Latin.
I can only assume that Anonymous has his Standard dances mixed up with his Latin. Or maybe it was his teacher, who wouldn't be much of a teacher if indeed that is how they teach.

"Anothe Guest. I also looked up the World Super Stars DVD. I have also looked at many tapes and disks. At this point in time i haven't seen any examples of the body moving ahead of the leg On a Forward Walk or anywhere else.
The only time the body weight goes ahead to the point of imbalance is on a Rumba Walk in Latin.
I can only assume that Anonymous has his Standard dances mixed up with his Latin. Or maybe it was his teacher, who wouldn't be much of a teacher if indeed that is how they teach."

IF you want to take a serious look at it, consider that there are two differnet issues.

1) Body moving before the leg. This is almost always the case, even in pivots.

2) Body getting ahead of the free leg. This happens too, but in more select circumstances. The classic case where it is really important is a forward step of the right foot with CBM. It's needed there to keep the leg in your own space and out of your partners. The problem is that the same reason it is needed makes it hard to take a pictue that clearly shows it - the partner's body is in the way. This is also quite useful in some outside partner actions such as the weave - there is it quite beneficial to project the body forwards, and have the legs swing mostly to being under the body, but not get out more than a trivial distance ahead of it. A number of ladies fail to do this, and instead end up leaning over backwards, trailing a mile behind their legs... looks really silly, but hey, if it's the way you want to dance...

I simply cannot understand how a pivot (which involves half a complete turn)can be danced without the standing foot turning on the floor. I think this is anatomically impossible, but i am willing to learn!
also, when it was stated that the body never stops moving, but the legs start and stop - this would mean detachable legs. so i think something slightly different was meant. Maybe the feet start and stop? This is an example of how precise verbal descriptions are so difficult.

"I simply cannot understand how a pivot (which involves half a complete turn)can be danced without the standing foot turning on the floor. I think this is anatomically impossible, but i am willing to learn!"

The action being danced should perhaps not really be called a pivoting action since the standing foot doesn't really pivot - instead it is a different action that seems to work better in pivot-like figures. Having your only standing foot rotating on the floor tends to put you in a fairly precarious position, which is perhaps why it is widely avoided.

As for how it's done, you should be able to turn out your moving leg 135 degrees from your standing foot without difficulty. And you should be able to turn in your standing foot 45 degrees while placing it. Add those up and what do you get? Also, even though the foot may pivot little if at all, you ankle can let the standing knee can dance across the foot as your weight arrives to, and then prepares to leave the inside edge.

And remember that you will drive towards the following step with your body and even foot alignments still quite underturned relative to your direction of travel.


"also, when it was stated that the body never stops moving, but the legs start and stop - this would mean detachable legs. so i think something slightly different was meant. Maybe the feet start and stop? This is an example of how precise verbal descriptions are so difficult."

Okay, no real argument with that. Though generally when we speak of the legs moving we aren't talking about the top end of the leg going along with the body, we are talking about the leg doing something relative to the body, specifically either catching up with the body or moving out in advance of it.

Another way of looking at it is that the pivot on ball of foot is generally replaced by toed in placement. Now that I really experiment with it, I think that this may accomplish 80 degrees of turn or so - the foot placed nearly pointing to center. During this the body should be moving almost directly down LOD, resulting in a very closed position of the thighs. In effect, the moving foot will make ) shaped path on the floor. Some would probably be tempted to (inaccuratly) call this position CBMP.

My standing foot rotates on the floor in several figures. for example telemark turn. In fact i've been criticised by coaches for placing my right foot (step 2) strongly turned. Instead of turning on it(just a habit from my tennis days, when the feet can't turn). I have no problem doing this and also in pivots - without feeling precarious at all.