Sorry you're all having no luck with AM studios, I've been at an AM studio in Maryland for going on three years now and I wouldn't consider switching. I've had many excellent lesson's and great instructors. Dancing is not cheap and I feel as though I get all that I pay for and more. Don't judge all AMs from a few bad experiences, I'm sure all studios have there good and bad points. I believe it has more to do with what you make of it. Judge for yourself, remember nobody will force you to stay.

Why does Arthur Murray Require all of their teacher to Certify? It's all about insuring the quality of instruction that our clients expect. Arthur Murray uses it's own nationally recognized certification process to insure a world wide standard, I.E. what you are taught in Seattle Washington is the same as what you would be taught in Osaka Japan,(yes we have a school there)try to say that about any independent out there. Arthur Murray International has a reputation for quality and service that is almost 100 years old. Our system of Instruction is one hand critisized by our competitors and then copied by the same on the other, so it must be a good one. Not just anyone can be an Arthur Murray instructor, in fact many applicants do not make thourgh the initial interveiwing process. I would Challange you to sign up for a intro special, a service we provide to new clients as a way to sample the school and it's time honored teaching method, and then make your dertemination after you've done more than speculate. (intro specials run about what you would pay for a group class at an independent)

are you a stdio owner o a employee that has been brain washed? your sylabus is not the greatest and your teaching system is flawed in many ways. this is coming from a ex fads guy ex ami guy and now a very very successful independent studio owner an competitor. bottom line franchise only cares about the money coming in and not the dancing going out. why do you think there is such a high turn over rate with all franchise studios. teachers can barely teach there and there fab certifications means nothing in the real world. istd is the only way to be recognized in the world of dance and guess what they teach the same syllabus here in america as japan and england and the rest of the world. another invalid argument used by franchise schools

You obviously Have no clue what your are talking about. The AMI sylabus has been copied by numerous independent studios as well as the teaching methodd. Independent studio owners send thier staff in to AMI studios to see how teachers put the method into practice. Franchicess bring in some of the most respected dancers and teachers in the ballroom world to train thier teachers dancing, Why just in the last two months we have worked with dance coaches like Viki Venka, Lola Volaire, Ingvar Gierson, just to name a few. Are credentials are recognized everywhere. you need to do some research befor eyou make such uninformed claims. sounds to me like you a bit bitter.

"You obviously Have no clue what your are talking about........Are credentials are recognized everywhere. you need to do some research befor eyou make such uninformed claims. sounds to me like you a bit bitter."

On the contrary, you obviously have no idea what goes in the world of REAL DANCING, where it is about dancing and not selling packages to little old ladies or a syllabus with umpteen levels of bronze.

There are some good people involved in the franchise system, but their credability elsewhere is based upon their personal credibility.

Their franchise crendentials count for NOTHING outside of the system where they were granted.

You want real credentials? Get your certification from ISTD or a similar independent body. Credentials awarded by your employer are nothing but a joke.

The reason you have your own certification system is that most of your system-trained staff could not begin to pass the exams of these respected bodies. The few who could are in most part the foreign-trained imports, and they probably will once they escape their indentures and set up as independent teachers.

Actually there are only 4 levels of bronze as their are in many other independents again who's teaching systems are based on AMI's. No teacher of any subject with a goal minded method would teach a student without having them commit to a curriculum. At a University one would be expected to enroll and complete 4 years of education before recieving even the lowest level degree. And as for the selling of packages to "old Lady's" my eldest student is in her 60,s but my youngest is 12 your really not well informed.

"No teacher of any subject with a goal minded method would teach a student without having them commit to a curriculum."

You've obviously never habitually studied with a teacher of real competition dancing, as opposed to the sheltered closed-to-the-franchise sort and those independents which are nothing more than knockoffs of the franchise idea.

If you had, you'd know that it isn't about the material, it's about the execution. You can't hand someone a plan of study that says "We'll be doing these same basic things for the next 6 years" - but in fact, that is exactly what the core subject will be!

The umpteen (sorry, only four) levels of bronze come about when someone sets up a system that tries to put the emphasis on the material instead of the execution. Instead of picking a handful of figures to demonstrate the key ideas and keeping the emphasis on mastery of their execution, the idea is to present an unmanageable variety that keeps the students dependent on frequent lessons that can be taught by low-skilled teachers.

When a student "commits" to the curriculumum path of Bronze II-IV, what they've actually done is agreed to be perpetually distracted from the taks of actually learning something fundamental and important about dancing. In other words, it a symptom of a business built not around education, but about maximizing profits.

And why would they do it that way?

Because there really isn't all that much money to be made in efficiently teaching real dancing. And to make what there is, you have to have really expert teachers, of a level where most will refuse to work for anyone else and instead insist on dealing directly with their students.

If you want to make a lot of money as a business owner, you have to create a system where you can charge students an above-average price to be taught by teachers working for below-average wages, and pocket the difference yourself. And then you have to find a way to market it... The business plan and supporting materials for doing that is exactly what the owner gets for their franchise fees.

Again you show your ignorance Arthur Murrays has never claimed to be an organziation that creates or inccourages "competition" dancers and as I have intrusted with teachers who do and yes the good ones do have a curriculum we at Arthur Murrays create social dancers with infassis on edicate and craft, which is not to say that Arthur Murray instructor can not teach a student who wishes to compete, it has been my experience that most independentants only will teach a student who wishes t compete and why? To perpetuate thier own desires not that of their clients. The Material taught is all about the technique and execution. Perhaps the reason you are having difficulting earninig a living teaching is because perhaps you don't enjoy the process of teaching. I do I work hands on with each and every students in every way, from becoming good solid enjoyable social dancers to confident strong people. It is our mission to improve the quality of peopls lives through dance. I am not a franchisee yet I do well in my trade, and am paid better than it appears you have been. This is not a job but a career, "Low Skilled" hardly the staff is encuoraaged to improve thier knowledge and skill through increased pay and benifits yes benifits. I've heard horror stories from students taking lessons in those unregulated unsupervised independent schools where someone taking lessons was allowed to teach classes and lesson to other clients with no credintails what so ever. Wow and what happens when those students are unhappy with the lesson? NOthing they still have to pay for the class not so in AMI, lessons are refunded to any clients should they feel dissatisfied with their lesson or experience for any reason. Doubt any independents will say that, why, because they have to make money just like everyone. Don't be a hypocrate.

"I have intrusted with teachers who do and yes the good ones do have a curriculum"

Wrong. Maybe the marginal ones you've worked with, but not the leading ones. I mean they have one, but it's too simple to write down. The real study is repetition and refinement.

"we at ........... create social dancers with infassis on edicate and craft"

Actually, you create people who know only your private moves and have no generic dance skills. If you'd stop with the umpteen levels of bronze, and instead teach basic concepts, you could create good all around dancers. But you'd need much more experienced teachers, and you' wouldn't make so much money doing it.

"it has been my experience that most independentants only will teach a student who wishes t compete and why?"

Not really true. Most don't care, but they will soon know as very few people manage to maintain the focus to be a good student without a goal such as competition. You think you establish a substitute for competitive pressure with the program of your umpteen level syllabus, but what you actually do is establish a perpetual distraction from ever setting down to focus on learning real dance skills.

You want to teach a student something? Take the first six figures of your bronze I syllabus and teach the students to actually lead and follow them with sound universal dance technique. Then prove it by encouraging them to go out and dance with studnets from other unafilliated schools. Then do the same for the silver. Cut out the fluff and teach the real skills. But no, there's no money in that unless your or your employees are outstanding.

"and am paid better than it appears you have been"

Wrong.

"This is not a job but a career, "Low Skilled" hardly the staff is encuoraaged to improve thier knowledge and skill through increased pay and benifits yes benifits."

Real dance teachers have 10-15 year personal competitive careers in their backgrounds, often with a decade of judging experience too. Yet you charge more for your minimally experienced employees than it costs to take a lesson with one of those experts.

There are some good teachers who own franchise studios, but when they want the pleasure of teaching real students, they have to compete with indpendent experts for that business. As a result, the rate they charge their own serious students is a market rate for serious study, which can be comparable or even less than the package rate for working with their less experinced employees!

"I've heard horror stories"

We've all heard horror stories, but the fact that they happen in both franchises and independents demonstrates that there is no protection from them other than basic buyer beware cautions of the sort that studio owners don't want you to take:

1) Always pick your teacher and deal directly with them - eliminate the middlemen. If you are dissatisfied, pick another.

2) NEVER EVER pay in advance for any reason other than your own convenience, and then no more than you could afford to loose. Real teachers do not push packages - they don't need to, and you don't have to buy a package to get their ordinary fair rate.

3) Look at the teacher's real world indicators of expertise: personal competitive or judging experience, success of their existing students, reputation in the eyes of other teachers, certification by independent bodies without a conflict of interest, etc.

"Wow and what happens when those students are unhappy with the lesson?"

Since they aren't on a package, they chalk the cost of one lesson up to a learning experience and move on. What happens in your system when the only qualified teacher gives up in disgust and leaves, while their students have 50 lessons still on the books???

"so in AMI, lessons are refunded to any clients should they feel dissatisfied"

Ah, but you forget to read the fine print! The lessons are formally priced at an artificially inflated rate, but marketed at the effective rate of divding the package cost by the sum of the paid for lessons and the free bonus lessons included in the package. If you cancel and demand a refund, you loose the free lessons, and so the ones you took end up costing you the outrageously inflated rate, instead of the rate that you were lead to believe you'd get by buying the package. Whears if you have a teacher honest enough to price their lessons at the price they expect you to pay for each lesson, then you've only paid a reasonble rate for each single lessons that you actually took. And since you didn't pay in advance, you don't need any national guarantee against their potential insolvency.

I'll believe that packages are about convenience when the package rate is the same as the single lesson rate, and the motivator for both sides is simply the convenience of paying/collecting every few weeks instead of at each lesson.

"Doubt any independents will say that, why, because they have to make money just like everyone. Don't be a hypocrate."

Real teachers have no need to say that, as they collect the money for each lesson AFTER THAT LESSON. Under that system, you can each cheat the other out of one lesson fee by not showing up or by not being a competent teachcer, but because both student and teacher trust that the other is serious about what they are doing, they take that minimal risk in stride. But in fact, I have had famous teachers offer not to charge if the student is dissatisfied - there's very little risk for them in that as they are better off not having any student who would exercise that option.

[sic]

Hmmm! Makes one wonder why so much advertising places emphasis on couples in formal competitive dress instead of everyday wear at social events.

OB