"Anonymous. I 'm in a bit of a hurry and haven't studied the posting. But if I know what CBMP is and I stand stationary as in step one of a turn with CBMP How can I swing my shoulder when it is already there. try it.
The way I am being taught with CBM, the shoulder comes in late, it will always be travelling faster than the foot . So the shoulder is travelling to the foot position which is turning at the end of one. I'm Off."

You swing and rotate the opposite side a little bit more. Obviously, CBM in a figure that commences with an opposite side lead (one that will move into CBMP) is more muted than CBM that commences with a same side windup. But it is still CBM. And it still cannot replace CBMP when CBMP is also required for outside partner.

And more important, there are numerous examples where both CBM and CBMP are explicitly requested - every natural turning step that is also outside partner.

I can't follow the flow of this discussion with at least 2 different people using the same name.
however, buried in all of it is the statement "never twist the spine". How can anyone dance competitvely without twisting the spine?

"however, buried in all of it is the statement "never twist the spine". How can anyone dance competitvely without twisting the spine?"

They can't... which says a lot about the competence of those making the recommendation.

Anonymous. Of course the spine can be without a twist. For starters stand up straight. Do that excercise we have all done at some time or another, and turn the whole body as a unit. That is turning to each side. Isn't the spine straight without twisting. Now start using your using your shoulder to turn. Isn't that twisting the spine out of shape. Now apply which ever you like to your dancing. Only one is correct. I'd love to see some of you spinning in the Ballet with a twisted spine. Turn your whole side without twisting it. When dancing drive your not twisted spine in the direction you wish to go. Your partner will love you for not sending her signals that you are going in two different directions at the same time. Try. The proof is in the pudding.

now turns your hips without turning your shoulders.

oops - just twisted your spine didn't you.

sure hope you don't try to dance without doing that in situations where it's necessary...

Anonymous. When exactly would you turn your hips without the shoulders. Now your getting back to one of your postings when you wrote that on a Lock the hip goes back without the shoulder. I thought you had got past that one. Remember your partner has got to mirror your movement. How would she feel on a Heel Turn if she found her spine being twisted. You try it yourself.

Anonymous the first one who twists.
Imagine for a second that your body is represented by a small table with a lamp on it. The lamp represents your upper body, and the table with its legs represents your base. If we move the lamp. It will slide around the table
On the other hand if we actually move the table both the table and the lamp will move around as a single unit
When the upper body turns ahead of the base the whole of the body gets thrown out of alignment. You cannot turn straight up over the axis of rotation and you fall off balance. So in order to produce a balanced turn, you need to learn how to move the table instead of the lamp. In other words the turn must be produced from the base
You may be saying to yourself. But I know that I have seen good dancers using there arms and upper body to aid in the rotation. There is a big difference between aiding and in and being the primary source of rotation.
The top must follow the base through rotation.If it overtakes the base the stability is lost.
Well what do you know about that. If you want more models and so on. Overhead shots as well . Go to the Learning Center. Go look and learn.

Anna,

When you advance more you will realize it is more complicated than that. Within a positional alignment of the body vertically, different parts turn differently. Some actions commence turn more in the hips, and some more in the top.

Remember dancers are not tables - they are two bodies trying to fit through the same space, and that requires complementary shapes to get the parts that need to go first on their way while keeping the other parts out of the way. Square bodies just don't cut it.

"Anonymous. When exactly would you turn your hips without the shoulders."

In reverse turns, and also at the very prelude beginning of the sharpest natural turns, for example into a natural heel turn that will become a hover cross.

"Now your getting back to one of your postings when you wrote that on a Lock the hip goes back without the shoulder. I thought you had got past that one."

Someday you will start dancing it that way too, assuming you are willing to continue learning. It is the direct correction to the original posters problem. Obviously the degree to which it should be done is not infinite, but it is the action that directly opposes this exceedingly common problem of backward arch/fall when the lady moves back in CBMP.

"Remember your partner has got to mirror your movement. How would she feel on a Heel Turn if she found her spine being twisted. You try it yourself."

There are various sorts of partnering needed in different dance actions. But in this case, the partner do something indeed very similar. And it feels great on the back action of something like a double reverse spin. Commence the turn in the hips and don't turn the top until step 2 - this lets you move directly into it with ease.

Anonymous. Have you had a look at the Learning Center, with the overhead shots. Please don't tell me that the lady on a heel turn, Double Reverse or not. You would have her turning the hips without the top. Are you turning into step one or at the end of step one. I think if you are not careful you would lose contact your partner. And this is the acid test, turning with two straight spines or two twisted. Which is it. Lets remember you are still under the opinion that on a Lock Step the hip goes without the top.