Hi Jonathan,
I am currently working on my 1/2 natural turn in waltz and was going through your previous explanations of swing , CBM and the release of energy concept.
I am having trouble trying to undertand how all of this falls in place in this step or for that matter any figure. If possible could you break down the figure and explain excalty what needs to be done at each step 1,2,3.
I know it will be hard but it will help me understand these concepts better.

Thanks in advance

I look forward to Jonatan's explanation on this one. And I complement you on a very good question. I can only say what I have been taught and do. If you watch a major international competition you will find that nearly all start with a very basic step the Natural Spin Turn or an Imptus Turn. In 1 1/2 minutes you very rarely see another. The Feather in the Foxtrot you will see one only.
To get back to the point.CBM on the Intro. Step out, or leave the left side behind, Then swing the left side into step two. and than go for the slowest draw up you can manage. If you tackle the Foxtrot the same. You will swing up on two and as Billy Irvine said on this one there is lift. Let that carry you through onto three with the good old CBMP. Good luck. I hope you get some sensible comments and not some clown who dances with his head under his armpit writting.

What to do on the first three of a Natural Turn in the Waltz, This is how it was explained to me. If we stood feet together and stepped to the side on the toe and analyse what we were doing. I think you will agree that all of us would flex the standing knee to push to the side. We wouldn't need anybody to tell us to or how. Heres the rub. Put the first step in front of that step to the side and the flexing of the knee gets lost. In a nutshell we should drive that first step and also drive onto the second step at the end of the first. Two driving steps out of three. Do that correct and everthing else will fall into place. This came off an instruction tape by a very well known teacher. Good Luck

"What to do on the first three of a Natural Turn in the Waltz, This is how it was explained to me. If we stood feet together and stepped to the side on the toe and analyse what we were doing. I think you will agree that all of us would flex the standing knee to push to the side. We wouldn't need anybody to tell us to or how. Heres the rub. Put the first step in front of that step to the side and the flexing of the knee gets lost. In a nutshell we should drive that first step and also drive onto the second step at the end of the first. Two driving steps out of three. Do that correct and everthing else will fall into place. This came off an instruction tape by a very well known teacher. Good Luck"

Don, the critical difference which you are overlooking is that in an ordinary natural turn, although the second step ends sideways, it begins forwards, and thus the action is more forwards than sideways. Closed changes and 1/4 turn naturals use something closer to the sideways action you have described.

Anonymous. This can be a good debatable point whether the second step is more forward, or is it across the floor. If we go to Richard Gleave's Tape he does teach swinging forward with that second step and finishing backing diagnal to the centre and continue to turn to back LOD. The trend today seems to be as in the book with one exception. The second step is sideways having turned over the RF and finishing backing LOD. The one exception today is step four for the man, not the lady. goes backwards diagnal to wall with the LOD. The lady now has a unrestricted path for her fourth step which is more to straight forward down the LOD. Richard does teach to drive after that second step is in place. Or so he says on his instruction tape. It is possible use one of both alignments. I doubt that any experienced teach would try to alter a pupil who was succesfuly dancing either one way or the other.

"The one exception today is step four for the man, not the lady. goes backwards diagnal to wall with the LOD. The lady now has a unrestricted path for her fourth step which is more to straight forward down the LOD."

Yes, for some reason most men can't manage to grant the lady the same courtesy on step four of making space through their body (without simply stepping to the side) that the lady grants the man on step 1. If any lady sat out to the side like that on step one, we'd laugh her off the floor. But most of the men haven't learned yet.

"I doubt that any experienced teach would try to alter a pupil who was succesfuly dancing either one way or the other."

You obviously haven't studied with any of the masters then. They teach the same methods to everyone, or at least to everyone who is interested in listening. Typically a few of the arrogant ask for coaching in their current mistakes and will get that; the rest will invite the teacher to teach and as a result learn something previously overlooked about the fundamental skills of dancing.

Anonymous. When I wrote a coach wouldn't alter a couple I had in mind those who are at the top Professional or Amateur. What they would get is how to improve on what they already have had some success with. Having said that some friends of mine who are living abroad went to the UK very highly placed and didn't get past eight bars of Samba without being stopped. This couple are now in the top forty world wide. That Michael is a tough coach. It must have paid off though by the results.

"Anonymous. When I wrote a coach wouldn't alter a couple I had in mind those who are at the top Professional or Amateur."

Have you ever watched such a couple take a lesson? I have. When they are receptive, they get altered... when they are arrogant, they waste their money and the teachers time getting comments no better than their grandmother could provide.

"Having said that some friends of mine who are living abroad went to the UK very highly placed and didn't get past eight bars of Samba without being stopped. This couple are now in the top forty world wide. That Michael is a tough coach. It must have paid off though by the results."

Sounds like your friends were smart enough to be willing to be altered.

""I doubt that any experienced teach would try to alter a pupil who was succesfuly dancing either one way or the other."

You obviously haven't studied with any of the masters then. They teach the same methods to everyone, or at least to everyone who is interested in listening. Typically a few of the arrogant ask for coaching in their current mistakes and will get that; the rest will invite the teacher to teach and as a result learn something previously overlooked about the fundamental skills of dancing."

Don's observation in ontext is perfectly valid. Your retort on the other hand was not called for.

Rha

"Don's observation in ontext is perfectly valid. Your retort on the other hand was not called for."

Don's opinion may be valid, but it's factually wrong. Top teachers routinely request fundamental changes from everyone, already succesful couples included. The only exceptions are those couples who insist on wasting the teacher's time by working within the confines of their present methods - they can't be taught anything, they can only be coached. And it doesn't take much of an expert dancer to merely coach dancing - expertise is only required to teach.